You dont get to 2 finals and compete and run both teams close in both if your bottlers.

Yes as long odds underdogs we cannot accuse the 2018 side of being bottlers. The form book and bookies were correct. By and large Wigan have better playes and are more effective as a team. We can beat the top sides in a one-off situation occasionally but not consistently yet.

There have been a lot of different players used in those six finals. Ratchford, Hill and Westwood are the consistent links in all of them.



Maybe after the game when Ratchford was being presented with the Harry Sunderland they should have asked him why he freezes in big games.



Also I'm sure I remember the great Les Boyd team bottling it in two Lancashire Cups, a John Player Special and a Premiership final. Could have done with a psychologist back then to help big Les with his nerves on the big occasion.

Yeah good one. A lot of those finals were against the only full time professional side in the league.



When you play a GF the results are largely 50:50 between the teams as no team can win every final. However the CC final losses are harder to explain away.

The two CC final losses were both against teams that we were fancied to beat and who had never won a Wembley final before they beat us. Hull in 2016 could have gone either way. Catalans this year was for me the most disappointing of our defeats as it was a game we didn't turn up ready to perform. We didn't "bottle it" on the big stage, we turned up lethargic against a fired up Catalans who had blown Saints away in the first 20 minutes and allowed them to do the same to us. We were then always chasing the game, and due to our limited attacking potential that is not a good position for us.



Your 50:50 theory is interesting because I looked up the stats. Wigan: won 5, lost 5. Saints: won 5, lost 5. Bradford: won 3, lost 3.



The two anomaly clubs are Leeds (won 8, lost 2) and Wire (won 0, lost 4).



It's also sobering to think that Leeds, Wigan and Saints have won 18 out of 21 GFs to date and those 3 from Bradford in a 5 year period (which coincided with Noble being their coach) were the only time the three-club dominance has been broken.



There is also a question about whether the CC and the GF are fundamentally different kinds of trophies to win. Between 2003 and 2012, Leeds were in 5 CC finals, and lost them all, but were in 6 GFs and won them all. Over that same period, Saints were in 4 CC finals and won them all, and were in 5 GFs and lost them all....? At least in the past 3 seasons we've been consistent in CCs and GFs.

No complaints from me. best team won. and yes, we did bottle it. Again.



Defensively and coming out our own half we're pretty much bang on. as soon as we get to the 4th and 5th tackle in their 30 or 20 we look completely clueless. A high bomb to the corner on EVERY last tackle play will not win you the game. We've been asking and crying out for Roberts to take the line on all season, why did he suddenly decide that he has the ability to ghost through the line instead of passing the frigging ball on Saturday? Unbelievable. All Ratch needed was a bit of effort from literally anyone to be a support runner and we could have had that game. Grand finals are all about commitment and the 1% extra efforts. Wigan had that and we didn't. When it kicked off at half time we should have gone out in the 2nd half and murdered Escare for starting it, the cocky garlic eating surrender monkey.



Also, to the two delightful gentlemen sat behind me, who left with 15 minutes to go screaming how effing s*** we are... Don't come to a GF again if all you are going to do is slag the team off for the full 80 minutes. and then call all the Warrington fans around you deluded happy clappers for believing we could possibly win anything. yes you may be right in some respects but its quite annoying, everyone within 10m all said 'thank f*** for that' when you got up and left.



You had nothing to say and you said it too loudly.



Other than that and barring the result, had a great day out on the ale. I'll never get bored of seeing my team walk out at a final.

I think what I understand by “bottlers” is very different to what you do. I would say we largely played as we did all season (in fact in defence and penalties better) but we weren’t good enough. As I understand it , bottling is not performing to your potential due to pressure of the occasion.

definitely over achievers this year

Bottlers lose 6 in a row, just sort Browns replacement, change the captain, use BMM correctly and we could be a great team to watch, again.

Overachievers in terms of reaching the Grand Final, most certainly. On Saturday we gave it our all but lost against a better team.



However, the Challenge Cup final at Wembley is where they bottled it. Better team than on paper, massively outnumbered their supporters, but the Catalans players just wanted it more.



Reckon we'll make one of the finals next season though - a chance to put things right.

i dont think we bottled it, we just weren't good enough... You cant fault the effort.



price has done very well to get us to 2 finals, when you consider the mess he was left with.



Brown and Roberts have to be one of the worst pairings in SL.... To get to 2 finals with those 2 in the halves, is nothing short of a miracle... Hopefully next season, we are going in with 2 new ones and around 3 or 4 new players in other positions as well.



While defeat was disappointing, i honestly did feel like we had a chance going into the game. So it wasn't a surprise at all...... Challenge cup final on the other hand

Can't give you an argument the game in Wembley was a sorry affair indeed.