more effective than Byrne but his accent adds to his expectation

Byrne has been superb this season.

Just been thinking about this. Especially if we get to the big dance, if we have a full squad for the grand final, (excluding Thornley) Leuluai comes in on the bench, but a prop would have to miss out.

I think if we play saints, Mago could be the one to miss out as he hasn’t really stepped up against them this year and they’ve handled him quite well. If it’s any other team then Mago plays and Ellis misses out.

Byrne doesn’t deserve to be dropped, he’s been outstanding all year and hasn’t taken a backwards step.

Singleton has proved us all wrong and has really stepped up this year, I thought he would’ve ended up losing his place especially after we signed Cooper but Singo has been quality.

Ellis hasn’t been great, often the 3rd man into tackles and doesn’t initiate contact, also struggles with his lateral movement.



His carries were okay. Kick off returns very good.



He’s comfortably behind Singleton, Havard, Cooper and Byrne.



Peet doesn’t seem to trust Mago to play decent minutes in high intensity fast games (only played about 17 minutes v Saints).



But he is Xfactor and has showed he can come up with a try assist that can turn a game on its head.



He’d my choice for the 5th prop over Ellis for that reason.



Just to add this shows how far we’ve come, Ellis would have been our top prop in 2020

mmm showed glimpses, still not agile enough and wooden, not been as good as Ellis for me

Byrne does a lot of work which often goes unnoticed and allows others to do the flashy stuff. Definitely in the top 4 imo.

Byrne does a lot of work which often goes unnoticed and allows others to do the flashy stuff. Definitely in the top 4 imo.

Seems to be against the consensus but i am with you Pieman. I think Ellis has been solid. I rate Byrne but he and Shorrocks really need to work on their ball retention. Nobody can play the perfect game but i would like to see improvement in that area. I think Powell comes back in and O'Neil drops out anyway and our attack gets blunted that way like it did last time. Just my opinion. I'm not Powell bashing, i just think we have a better alternative.

I think there is an added level of expectation with overseas players for sure and in the case of Ellis, he’s quite young and inexperienced himself. I personally just see a bit of a lack of aggression in him both with and without the ball. I look at Byrne and he’ll clobber people and even if he isn’t making masses of ground, he’s smashing in to the line. I watch Ellis and I can sort of see why he didn’t crack the NRL tbh. It’s all just a bit safe and steady. Even then he’s still played pretty well, so it’s now a case of us being able to get more out of him.

I don't really get the criticism of Ellis. From what I've seen this year he's been a very good addition to the side. He's in his mid-20's so still time to improve but based on what he's produced so far I don't think there's much of an issue. He's our 2nd best prop in terms of metres made and tackles made per game (behind Havard in both) and is generally a very consistent performer. His form has dipped a little in the last 3 games but not to a worrying degree.

We're still in the situation where we don't necessarily have stand out props that are among the very best in Super League but we do seem to have a lot of good props at a similar level. If one has a quiet game then another tends to play a little above their level.



For me it's only his very recent form that means Ellis could be dropped, but I don't think Singleton has been that much better and Mago obviously stands out as the one who does considerably less than all our other props. Mago's value comes from his offloading ability and that he's different to all our other middles, but Cooper is a good offloader too and maybe gives that option to drop Mago.

I commented on Ellis, much like I commented on Cust the other day and in both cases I’d like to point out that I’m not criticising them. What I am doing is looking at them and making observations on things they can improve on. Nobody is perfect and they both have things they can do better. I’ve been pretty happy with both and they’ve been good signings overall. It’s a good sign that I say I’m pretty happy with both but Ellis has a fight on his hands to keep a first 17 spot for next week and beyond and I’d probably bench Cust when Tommy is back. That’s how it should be with good sides. Good players can miss out on a spot in the team.



In terms of Ellis, I just think he needs to let the handbrake off. Get charging the ball in and get some aggression in to his defence. If he can do that, I think you go from having a pretty good player on your hands, to having a very good one.

He's been cited for biting so not sure he will even play?