You're looking to blame the wrong area of your team. Your forwards are soft and error prone (with and without ball).



Never thought I'd say that about a Wigan team a couple of years ago

Some quick thoughts as reading this site is fairly depressing atm





- McIlorum is really poor in attack this season, creating nothing. Logan was much more lively when he came on

- Mossop yet again showing just how inconsistent he is

- Discipline is still a disgrace, we have learnt nothing from the start of the season

- Williams and Smith combo will never work. George looks way more comfortable at 9

- Manfredi played well and kept Hall very quiet

- Handling is the worst I've ever seen it. We can't even do basic shift plays without at least 2 or 3 passes going behind/ahead of the next man or to ground

- Bateman has been far too quiet at loose



Wane finally admitting in the post-match interview that we gave away too many penalties.

Its not just the halves



totally lacking in any leadership. Its like there is an eerie silence befalls our players when we have ball in hand. No structure because its 13 individuals, just going through the motions.



Someone needs to start talking to the players and taking charge whilst on the pitch. Its all very well trying to lead by example, but you fall on your backside if no one looks like they can be bothered.



Williams looks totally out of his depth to me (and i dont think i have ever slated a young player on here), Smith looks like he is trying hard, but spends the whole game in his shell.



MM is just a passenger at the moment. He is cack going forward and his defense is labored and lacks any aggression. Thought Logan was our best player tonight.



JT was so so and Faz was absolutely pot. Has been terrible all year now.



Fair play to Budgie though, he looked a lot steadier. Dom M was not to shabby either.



its not good atm eh?

Williams, though, is not a 6!! He is a scrum half - preferably with Hampshire at 6.

The question is where does that leave Matty Smith. Bench 9 to spell MM if that is needed?

The problem with Conor Farrell is he isn't big enough - which is probably why Wane didn't put him on earlier.

Wigan might supposedly have a first team squad of 35 as keeps being mentioned, but where is there any size or power, particularly if a few players ( Flower and Lockers) are missing?

The problem may be that Wane is "too close" to the players he brought through the academy and junior teams - as Jonh has said, playing in a successful academy team should not guarantee your succession into the first team. Wigan have been crying out for a couple of big forwards for over a year - most teams seem to have several Antipodeans who are naturally bigger than most British players. Hence the shortcomings of the policy of mostly home grown/Wigan born players, when applied particularly to the forwards.

Cunningham and Long seem to have got it right at Saints - even the back row forwards are big units, including the young British lads.

There are and I was expressing some of them before the season started mainly about the centres given Thornley is injured and still inexperienced, Gelling isn't one and at the time I posted Sarge had done nothing of note there. At least he looks better than I expected.



The trouble is you have to throw in Williams at 6 as well plus Budgie is also inexperienced.



There is a lot of inexperience in first 13 slots. Going with an inexperienced 6 might be OK if the rest of the team were seasoned pros. He'd probably look a star in the 2010 or 2011 team with Deacon alongside him and lot of other experienced players about but he is one of many changes.



The question is who's fault is this? Did IL tell Wane that was the team he had so get on with it or did Wane convince IL it would be alright on the night? As I have said before I tend to think Wane believes his own propaganda at times and convinces himself that players like Williams are not just going to be OK but will be the next Sam Tomkins. I doubt IL [idoesn't[/i have a say as he holds the cheque book but I think Wane has said enough about this squad for me to think he really did believe it was all going to be fine and it was mostly his choice..







It would not surprise me. It's also clear some players wanted to leave Wigan and I am referring to Goulding and Taylor here. Taylor isn't at Hull FC despite supposedly wanting to return to Hull as his GF was homesick and Goulding clearly wanted away. Why? I don't think homesick or new challenge are realistic reasons to leave a club expected to be challenging for the honours.

If I remember correctly IL stated at the pre-season dinner that this was the finest team so far during his reign. Bizzare at worst, wishful thinking at best there Ian.

The team next week is going to be interesting.......!



Where does Wane go from here?



Will he give Hampshire a chance at 6 - or just play him at 1 to give Bowen a rest, so he is "right" for Good Friday?!!



And what about the forwards.....?



Might they persuade Jordan James to come out of retirement to add some "experience"....? At least he would be cheap as he is already on the payroll!

If only we had Goulding now.



He'd add some much needed experience to our back line and it would allow us to move Gelling into the pack to give us extra size.

He must have learnt that trick from Hetherington, who says that every year.



As a Leeds fan, couldn't believe how bad Wigan were tonight. We should have battered you & it's our own fault we didn't. Wane said post-match that Wigan "dominated Leeds for long periods", but I've no idea what game he was watching if he thought that. Even when Wigan were ahead they'd had one try-scoring chance to about four that Leeds managed to butcher.



If you're talking about halves, I thought Green was the best half-back in the league and it's obvious to an outsider that he carried Smith through last season.

End of the day you can only replace quality with projects and youngsters for so long then it will eventually start to catch up with you!

•wane stated after the WCC defeat to roosters we wern't big enough, why after the defeat to the Broncos was he still saying were not big enough??

•discipline cost us the grand final,why now 5 months on is it still a big problem?

• what the hell is this "Different" type of rugby he talked about actually achieving??



Sadly although he is wigan through and through his limitations as a coach are being exposed....he's the sort of guy that will tell you to run through a brickwall all day what he doesn't know is how to tell you to get round it.

Couldn't agree more.

Summed him up in a nutshell.