Maybe it's not just Flower who is affected by the perception that if there is retaliation they will be hauled over the coals?



If the Wigan forwards are think they are under the spotlight (whether they are or not in reality) they aren't going to rush in and smack someone like Simms regardless of what he did.



Also if the club has banned retaliation as some form of PR exercise they have basically cut the balls off the forwards.



And before anyone says I am condoning violence when I mention retaliation I don't mean poleaxing players as a matter of course over nothing but what most fans would actually like to see happen if their team's halfback got punched on the ground.



Maybe I am clutching at straws and the lack of aggression isn't due to any club directive or fear of disciplinary retribution and they really have become a powder puff pack but I hope not.

You're right, and so all similar attacks must be judged in the same way from now on. I await Simms's punishment with interest.

I don't think we've thrown a punch all year from memory and that in itself is worrying. There's been push and shove, ball throwing and even weird eskimo style nose running between John Bateman and Terry Campese at their place but we look scared to death of stepping out of line.



It's not a case of being thuggish but Rugby league is the ultimate game of aggression and intimidation and you can't be seen to not stand your ground. I'm not saying we go out and belt people for no reason but taking that Sims incident from Thursday, he wouldn't have got away with that 12 months back!



A game sticks in my memory that highlights the difference in us this year compared to last and that's the Magic game at the Etihad against Leeds. We went in as underdogs with plenty of injuries but we gave it to them (legally) and they didn't like it. When they came at us we went back at them and nobody have an inch.



I'd be playing that in video sessions all week and use that as the standard.

Spot on DaveO

Surely if players know it's an automatic red card for any punch (and the NRL is the same), they won't do it? And this applies to all teams, so there's no reason it should be hobbling Wigan any more than any other side.



Whether we think the automatic red thing is a good idea or not is another matter, but it shouldn't restrict us anymore than anyone else.

As I said in my original post







My point was the outrage about the GF incident wasn't synthetic as you said it was. I can't comment on the incident with Simms, beyond what I've said because I didn't see it.

RL rarely makes national headlines. Frankly the dailies and national news bulletins couldn't care less about it. We barely exist to them. In which case, for them to give such coverage to a foul and speak about it in such disgusted terms was HIGHLY synthetic. But I'm not just talking about that, I'm drawing a comparison between that very fake reaction to the Flower incident and the near non-existent reaction to the Williams incident - I don't think Wiggie and Slaphead even mentioned it. But as you say, you didn't see that and so can't comment. In which case, best to leave it there, eh?

Ouch. Not so much dyslexic...... more hungover.















FYI [iAndy[/i Flower OBE was the England Cricket coach until Jan 2014.

Against Salford on easter Monday Bateman came off the bench, had a fight with Haruaki, got binned, came back on, had a fight with Haruaki, got sent off, tried to carry it on down the tunnel!



Sutton had a fight during the Huddersfield home game as well and got decked. Got sin binned then came back on to score the winning try

So we agree it's been a while then.

Both Clark and Sims charged, yet Wigan didn't even get a penalty, I wonder if that's what Wane was referring to about a strong referee. www.superleague.co.uk/article/32 ... rs-charged?

Both Clark and Sims charged, yet Wigan didn't even get a penalty, I wonder if that's what Wane was referring to about a strong referee. www.superleague.co.uk/article/32 ... rs-charged?

A Grade B 1-2 match ban for Simms with the option to use an EGP