Not so much a Plan B, but maybe a change of mentality. We are so used to dominating the opposition team that after 20 mins or so the match is ours. But when you look at the the two 'big' games this season we conceded first by a stupid mistake from one of our own, after this we struggle to come back and then we are chasing the game, passing laterally instead of running forward.



I think I have heard Phil Clark allude to it slightly that if Wigan go in at half time behind they will lose. Can any one remember the last time that we have won from being behind at half time?



We just need some balls about us and someone to take the mantle and go forward and man up when the going gets tough. Instead we just go in our shells.

What was the point of Jack Hughes on the bench? He only came on in the 70th minute or something. Surely it would be better to have an inter-change hooker in that spot.



Interesting stats from the match relate to the metres gained (or not gained as the case may be) of your props:



Mossop 27m

Lauaki 51m

Prescott 18m

Lima 92m



in comparison with:



Morley 110m

Hill 122m

Carvell 47m

Wood 94m





You must be looking at recruiting a "senior" prop for next season to replace Lima.

I agree that’s what I tried to say. In short, if a ball when passed is in front of the hands on release, it’s forward! The ambiguity I spoke of was not mine its Stevo’s and others.

-+1 good post-

Again, that's what I said! (it's fat Stevo who has a different idea) "NOT ME" thank you.

Very true, and what most of us have been saying. Having said that, those stats doesn't take number of carries into account, and the lack of possession we had (due to our own mistakes) meant yours got way more carries than ours. I was impressed with Hill, though - you've got a good one there.

That's the point I was going to make.



Wire had to make about 90 less tackles. They had 10 more completed sets than Wigan. The errors and tackling took a lot of petrol out of the tank. Under those circumstances Wigan did well to keep the score down.



Just to illustrate it a little further.

The four props Paul named made from Wire made 62 tackles, the four Wigan props he named made 82 tackles.

Quote Ian 77 Redux="Ian 77 Redux"Here it is (albeit that the game is goverened by laws, not rules) www.therfl.co.uk/a_guide_to_the_ ... rward_pass =#FF0040Direction of Pass 1. The direction of a pass is relative to the player making it and not to the actual path relative to the ground. A player running towards his opponents’ goal line may throw the ball towards a colleague who is behind him but because of the thrower’s own momentum the ball travels forward relative to the ground. This is not a forward pass as the thrower has not passed the ball forward in relation to himself. This is particularly noticeable when a running player makes a high, lobbed pass. It doesn't matter if the ball travels forward. It matters if it was passed forward. You might not like it, it may fry your brain, but it's a fact. Now, chances are, if the ball travels forwards the ball was passed forward but it's not a pre-requisite.'" “Momentum rule” is Stevo’s term NOT MINE and not wishing to be rude, but within the contexts of the argument about a forward pass, what does it matter if “HE” uses the wrong word, be it rule, or law I’m sorry but this point just seems to be splitting a hair to no purpose. IF A BALL LEAVES THE PASSER HANDS IN FRONT OF THOSE HANDS, IT IS A FORWARD PASS. It doesn’t matter where the bloke who catches is! In the stand, in the dressing room or on the moon, because by then the game should have been stopped for an infringement.

Quote Ian 77 Redux="Ian 77 Redux"Here it is (albeit that the game is goverened by laws, not rules) www.therfl.co.uk/a_guide_to_the_ ... rward_pass =#FF0040Direction of Pass 1. The direction of a pass is relative to the player making it and not to the actual path relative to the ground. A player running towards his opponents’ goal line may throw the ball towards a colleague who is behind him but because of the thrower’s own momentum the ball travels forward relative to the ground. This is not a forward pass as the thrower has not passed the ball forward in relation to himself. This is particularly noticeable when a running player makes a high, lobbed pass. It doesn't matter if the ball travels forward. It matters if it was passed forward. You might not like it, it may fry your brain, but it's a fact. Now, chances are, if the ball travels forwards the ball was passed forward but it's not a pre-requisite.'" “Momentum rule” is Stevo’s term NOT MINE and not wishing to be rude, but within the contexts of the argument about a forward pass, what does it matter if “HE” uses the wrong word, be it rule, or law I’m sorry but this point just seems to be splitting a hair to no purpose. IF A BALL LEAVES THE PASSER HANDS IN FRONT OF THOSE HANDS, IT IS A FORWARD PASS. It doesn’t matter where the bloke who catches is! In the stand, in the dressing room or on the moon, because by then the game should have been stopped for an infringement.

A good post and I understand your point, but in saying that, if Wire lose to London this week does that still make them the best team in SL or would that be London because they have had a recent run of good form. Games will be affected by many things, injuries, suspension and rotation. Wigan have shown that form may be transient, only at the end of the season will we know which team was the most competent, till then it’s just snap shots of form.

taking carries into account



warrington top 3 meter makers (ratch excluded as he is the anomaly due to length field try)



westwood - 20 carries totaling 157m gain = average 7.85m per carry

hill -15 carries totaling 122m gain = average 8.1m per carry

morley - 14 carries totaling 110m gain = average 7.85m per carry



wigan top 3 meter makers



lima - 16 carries totaling 92m gain = average 5.75m per carry

o'loughlin - 18 carries totaling 74m gain = average 4.1m per carry

hansen - 11 carries totaling 62m gain = average 5.6m per carry



interestingly though i only used forwards but 4 0f the top 8 top meter makers for wigan are backs but i think that just shows the way that the warrington kicking game pinned you back as they will be kick return meters.

London aren't in the top 2, Wigan and Wire are. Over the course of the season we gain an impression who has performed the best via league positions.

1st played 2nd, 2nd dominated 1st. I don't think being in the top two now is simply a snap shot in of form considering we are now in Aug.



Now seriously, who do you think are the top two team in SL? Do you think perhaps London? Do you honestly think London have a chance of winning the league or GF?



Please. don't try to debate for the sake of debating. This is getting a little silly now.

Please do not take offence when none was meant. I only expanded your comments to show how another point of view could be put to your words. Debate is what these forums are for, you should not expect to have your say and then ask for others to accept it without comment, that’s not what it’s all about, and anyway I only passed comment once. Again I was not stirring it, or trying to be offensive, and after all I did say it was a good post in the first place