Its not the fact Wigan play hard which people dislike. People love the game being played hard. Its the fact Wigan rely on getting the referee on side, the tactic of trapping the tacklers arm in the tackle and rolling over on to it to try and milk a penalty, the tactic of holding a player up in a tackle and attacking the knee, the wrestling etc etc, Wigan may want to describe these things as playing the game on the edge, everyone else describes them as dirty.



You may think you are moving the game forward, unfortunately you are moving it forward to a place people dont want to go. I dont want to watch a game where people try and win by milking decisions, by underhand wrestling tactics, by tackling in such a way as to increase the pressure on opposition players joints, where wrestling technique counts for as much as passing, kicking and offloading, where the latest way to stretch a shoulder muscle or a bend a knee unnaturally plays as much a part in the game as a barnstorming run from a prop. Its quite frankly a boring game to watch.

Its Tomkins and as i stated above, why are Wigan being slated in relation to the cap when they are one of the few clubs not being investigated for tax dodging and hence breaching the cap rules with offshore payments and image rights?



Lets not let the facts get in the way of a good witch hunt.

Because 'tax dodging' isnt breaching the cap rules perchance? Because there is specific clauses within the cap rules which deal with an issue such as this and make clear that it wouldnt result in a cap breach? And because Wigan are famed for breaking the cap rules maybe?

You're 100% right but I'm afraid you're wasting your breath; clearly, you're jealous of Wigan's success etc etc.

When was the last time Tomkins milked a penalty by trapping the arm? Yes it was a tactic he used earlier in the season but the refs soon got wise to it, and in fact it now works against him as refs are wise to it and so are the defence who use it against him.



Lima is/was responsible for most if not all the rest of what you talk about and he got caned when he first came over, he has since changed his game and is no longer doing those things.



Wigan concentrate on defence without doubt, personally I like that, but to claim they are dull to watch is up there with JK claiming it is like watching paint dry as Trinity get length of the field tries scored past them by Amos Roberts in his pomp.

You keep using this word jealous, yet only you have mentioned it at all.

He tried it a fair amount today and would likely have got a penalty or two had Ganson decided to give his whistle the night off. He wouldnt still be doing if he wasnt getting the decision from time to time.



He is still doing these things, thats why people are complaining. And he isnt the only one.



That isnt an argument, its a statement, a ridiculous one at that. I find the way Wigan play the game boring, I find a lot of the game in Australia mind-numbingly boring only punctuated by glimpses of oustanding skill. Watching two players wrestle for a couple of seconds holds no interest for me, I dont go to matches and watch matches to see tackle technique it adds nothing to the spectacle of our game. When they put together a highlights package at the end of the year there will be clips of bone-crunching tackles, massive hit-ups, offloads, line-breaks, catches, side-steps etc, there wont be any of O'loughlin wrestling a player on to his back to buy his colleagues a couple of extra seconds, or Hoffman holding a player up whilst Lima works them over before putting them to the ground facing the wrong way so they have a couple more seconds to retreat the ten. Do you know why? Because it is boring to watch.

I'm sorry to doubt you but if you find the NRL boring to watch you are on a different planet to me. I have to question do you actually watch it?



I ask again, do not speculate, when was the last time Tomkins got a penalty for trapping the arm? I can name several occasions when he has been held down especially against Warrington where the defence used this tactic against him to ensure they got to lay on a little longer.



I was always coached by Trinity coaches, first man takes the ball second man takes the legs, the fact that good teams now put more men in the tackle should not be criticised if it is effective. How many players have been maimed by these despicable tactics. Clarkson took a shot fair play and Lima took the ban. Despite the Yorkshire Post report it was not a murder investigation.

Yes, i watch plenty. I even attended the '99 GF which was a fantastic spectacle.



Im sure you could, you have shown just how biased towards Wigan you are.



Good teams wouldnt need to put more men in the tackle, good teams wouldnt need to slow the ball down, good teams wouldnt need to attack the knee, they wouldnt need to milk penalties, they wouldnt need to wrestle at the PTB. It can be as 'effective' as you like, it doesnt mean it is a good thing or makes for a good spectacle, id rather be watching rugby actually being played than players wrestling on the floor.

So would I - as a wise man once said, "it's like watching paint dry."

So you watch the NRL and find it dull?



Tomkins milked a shed load of penalties early door this year I am not disputing that, what i am saying is because of this refs got wise and now he gets hammered the other ways. Its a double edged sword and at the moment he is paying for the refs scrutiny that he once benefited from, that the nature of the game.



All teams try to put bodies in the tackle your last paragraph sums up a good team. Its against the rules if you get penalised for it. Coaches criticise it because they want more pressure from refs. it's funny how nobody criticises Hudds anymore as they now are not as good at it as Wigan.



its funny how away from the ears of fans coaches and players rave about the tactics of Wigan.



its an argument i will never win, i understand that so will leave it there but, to be called blinkered by people trying to justify an offside try against the rules of the game then slam Wigan for cheating the cap yet follow teams being investigated by HMRC for offshore payments I find very very ironic..........and blinkered.

Didnt that bite him on the behind!!



Batley's finest, clearly a world class coach and someone all rugby people should listen to!